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Subject: Pruning a Brown Turkey fig bush? Replies: 6
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 3,429
 
There have been problems recently with the forum's photo-uploading function, so if it doesn't work, the problem may not be on your end. But, yes, when you are ready to post your reply, click "manage attachements" and it will allow you to select the photo you wish to attach.

I had held off on trying to answer your initial question because there are so many more experienced forum members out there, but since some time has gone by I'll take a shot at it, and hopefully someone will correct me if I get it wrong.

Fig trees may produce fruit on wood formed during the previous season's growth, or on new wood formed during the current growing season. Figs produced on last year's wood are referred to as the "breba" crop, and they tend to be larger and not as numerous as those produced on the current year's growth (called the "main" crop). It varies--some varieties only produce brebas, others produce only main crop, and others produce both.

Figs tend to be pretty adaptable when it comes to pruning. Many dormant figs can be severely pruned (or even frozen to the ground) and will still grow vigorously enough to produce a good main crop, but if all of last year's wood is pruned away, they can't produce any breba figs. In this situation, they tend to grow as bushes, sending up multiple new branches from the base each year. In situations where frost damage is minimal, some figs can grow to become very large trees, and may be pruned to control size or improve shape. So, depending on your variety, climate and objectives, you can prune a lot or not at all, and still get plenty of figs.

Subject: Forum Is Slow Replies: 9
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 875
 

I got that "storage limit exceeded" error repeatedly the other day as well, when trying to include images with one of my posts. I eventually had to have my son show me how to upload to an online file-sharing site, and then paste the images' URLs on that site into the box under F4F's "insert image" button, as a temporary work-around solution. It's a bit more complicated, but it works okay and you can put the images wherever you want them within your post. I emailed Jon to see if he knew what the problem might be, and he thought the overall forum's storage capacity was probably maxed out, and that he would have to check on it. So, I'm guessing it'll be taken care of before long.


Subject: Bird Brain Replies: 11
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 1,050
 
Gene, your mocking bird sounds like a genius! I'm glad mine aren't quite that good at breaking and entering. Noss' description of "feathered thugs" is right on the mark.

Rafed, I'm just glad to be plagued with birds rather than squirrels (except for once when I had a brief squirrel problem). At least birds can't chew holes in the plastic netting!

2007Giants--I always enjoy people's stories about maurading critters, and so I assume others feel the same way. It's especially nice when the story has a happy ending (at least for the fruit-grower)!

Subject: 5' white genoa / questions Replies: 2
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 969
 

Jon--would you give the same advice about planting young figs in October for an area that gets the occasional winter freeze? I had been planning to wait until spring before putting my new figs in the ground, to avoid the risk of frost damage, but your post makes me wonder if it would be better to plant them now and simply try to cover them when it gets cold. Does very much root development take place during winter? Any thoughts would be welcome--thanks.


Subject: Won't go dormant Replies: 11
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 1,275
 

John, in my very limited experience, cutting the water to my two in-ground figs forces them to drop their leaves and go dormant, and I've seen no ill effects.


Subject: Bird Brain Replies: 11
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 1,050
 
I recall some recent comments about how mocking birds are particularly sneaky when it comes to stealing fruit, and thought I'd share an experience. A few days ago I decided to cover a persimmon with bird netting because the birds were even eating the unripe, astringent fruit. I made a framework and covered it with netting, stopping about a foot from the ground with the intention of finishing off the bottom section with plastic sheeting (it keeps my scaley friends from getting their heads stuck in the netting).

A day or so later when I came back with the plastic, there were several mocking birds and a woodpecker inside the cage, having a feast. When the mockers saw me coming they all immediately swooped down and flew out through the narrow gap, while the dim-witted woodpecker flew squawking into the mesh and resisted all efforts to show him how to get out. After I had make a couple trips to the garage for tools, he still hadn't figured out how to escape, and I finally had to hose him down till he was too wet to fly, and then shoo him out under the netting. So, at least if you're comparing mocking birds to woodpeckers, there's no contest as to which species ended up with the brains!

As a post-script, it was pretty comical to watch the various birds' reactions after they realized the free lunch was over. It took about a day before they finally gave up and quit hanging around the cage; evidently they were hoping I'd change my mind and let them back in again. Fat chance!

Subject: bird netting enclosure Replies: 45
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 4,745
 

Gene-- My son showed me a different way to include the photos, so I was able to go back and add them to my previous post. Hopefully, they will illustrate what I was trying to describe.


Subject: bird netting enclosure Replies: 45
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 4,745
 

UPDATE 06 Oct 2010
The basic framework is up, using 1/2" EMT electrical conduit posts to support a 14' x 15' grid of rebar tie-wire, which will hold up the plastic bird netting. (Post spacing is 15 feet on center down the length of the enclosure, and 14 feet on center across the width.) Please note that there are power lines and phone wires visible, which aren't part of the framework.


To avoid having anything stick up above the wire support grid (where it might snag the bird netting), I drilled four holes in each post, roughly an inch and a half from the end, so that wires could be mounted by threading them through the end of the post and back out through one of the drilled holes. To make it easier to thread the wires, I "flared," or angled, each drilled hole with an old nail-set:




To keep things as cheap as possible, I secured each wire by wrapping it a couple of times around a "hog ring", and then crimping the C-shaped ring to form a tight "O". This creates a stop, so the wire can't be pulled back through the drilled hole.

(A more expensive, but better approach, would be to use threaded cable clamps, which can easily be removed if adjustments are needed. Stainless steel cable would be better than tie wire, and abrasion to the bird netting could be reduced by sleeving 1/4" irrigation tubing over the cable.)


I measured and laid out much of the wire grid while the posts were still lying on the ground, and then raised them all up and made the final crimp-connections from a ladder. (This was necessary because I had to work around existing branches; if someone was starting with bare ground or very young trees, they could make all the connections at ground level before raising the posts.)

The bottoms of the posts simply rest on the ground and do not have to be anchored (although once I install the netting I'll put a piece of brick or tile under each post to keep it from settling into the ground); everything is held in place by the tension of the wires, which are secured to the chicken wire fence. Tension on the wire is increased by moving the bases of the angled perimeter posts closer to the fence. (Although I don't much like the look of the angled posts, I chose to install them this way due to space limitations. Doing so will allow the netting to hang straight down at the perimeter, while avoiding any "shear" stresses on the posts, which aren't strong enough to resist any significant lateral force. With this arrangement the only stress on the posts is compression, and the weight they support is quite minimal. It would have been possible to keep all the posts vertical, but I would have had to move the fence out about 3-4 more feet, and I just didn't have enough room.)


The posts that support the central ridge are 12 1/2' high, and vertical; to get the extra height I used a coupler (see below) to splice a short piece to each standard 10' length. The perimeter height is currently 9 feet (10' post at an angle), but once I install the netting, I may be able to raise this a little higher, if there's enough overlap between netting and fence to allow it.




Subject: Growing Tips updated Replies: 4
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 854
 

Thanks, Jon--it's saved in my "favorites" folder. What a great resource! Also, thanks for all you do as moderator of this forum!


Subject: Fig tree prapagation Replies: 5
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 809
 

It's what I hope for!


Subject: Fig Branches In Water Replies: 14
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 1,947
 

Eeplox--This sounds very interesting. What kind of success rate do you get on the initial rooting in the bucket? Do most of them "take" okay? What length of cuttings do you use, and how much of that is under water? How long do you allow the roots to get before transplanting them to soil? And, do you have to do anything to increase humidity for the "in-air" portions? Any details you'd care to share will doubtless be of interest to many.


Subject: Stink Bugs Replies: 19
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 1,208
 

Wow! They sound like a real pain! I thought I had it bad, but they sound as bad or worse than any of the fruit-eating pests in my neighborhood.


Subject: Pawpaw Replies: 115
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 10,848
 
I emailed a guy in the local CRFG group, and he wrote back, "Yes I Have grown pawpaws.  I had one tree that grew quite well, but my dog dug it up after 6 months.  I did not replace it, but it did not present any problems." So, it looks like my figs will have a another "roommate" if I can decide on a variety and find a good source! Hopefully Pawpaw and Jujube varieties will both be less prone than figs to being mislabeled by the nurseries.
 
John--what variety of Jujube are you growing?

Subject: Fig Branches In Water Replies: 14
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 1,947
 

When a fig cutting grows roots in water like that, can it be successfully transferred to a soil situation?


Subject: Natural air layer? Replies: 20
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 1,556
 
Thanks All, for the recommendations. I like the idea of making the separation when it's dormant, so I'll girdle it now below the aerial root to encourage more root growth down below, and maybe do a small, baggie-sized air layer as well to get a few new roots started up higher, on the main stem, and then wait till the leaves have all dropped before taking the final step. Would it be best to hold off on separating the two sections until it's close to breaking dormancy, or should it be done soon after the leaves drop so the roots have more time to adjust?

Gorgi--When I was rooting these, I had them in a very high-humidity set-up.  Too high--several of them got moldy, but a few responded by growing aerial roots. I didn't pay much attention at the time because it seemed normal, after seeing Jon's photos of cuttings that sprouted roots in a trash bag with no soil at all. I didn't figure they'd amount to anything, and didn't notice until today that this root had grown all the way down and into the soil.

Subject: Natural air layer? Replies: 20
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 1,556
 

I noticed this morning that my Giant Amber cutting from UCD has a healthy-looking root that originates above the lowest branch. I'm thinking of cutting through the stem below this root in order to divide the forked tree into two individual plants; however, I'm concerned about separating the roots in the pot. Would it be best to make the cut and then see if I can gently pull the aerial-rooted piece up out of the soil without disturbing the main trunk's roots? I'm guessing that all of the fine roots and root hairs will get pulled off, but that if I nip off most of the leaves to offset the reduced water uptake, and then repot it to a shady spot with a cover to reduce water loss through the remaining leaves, it might make it. Thoughts?

Attached Images
jpeg giant_amber_1.jpg (96.27 KB, 157 views)
jpeg giant_amber_2.jpg (101.29 KB, 131 views)


Subject: Pawpaw Replies: 115
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 10,848
 

Bass--In an effort to expose my small collection of figs to a little cultural diversity, I'm looking for a few additional types of fruit that might grow in Tucson (and that I'm unlikely to find in the grocery store). You've convinced me to find a Li Jujube, and I'm wondering about a Pawpaw as well. Do you think it might have a snowball's chance in Tucson? I've read online that they can produce in zone 8, and I'm in 8a, but it also sounds as if they like some humidity, which we only experience from July-September.


Subject: Rancona and Blanca De Maella Figs (Asian Pears, JuJu Bees) w/pics Replies: 18
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 2,519
 

Thanks Bass, I'll have to see if I can find a Li.


Subject: Rancona and Blanca De Maella Figs (Asian Pears, JuJu Bees) w/pics Replies: 18
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 2,519
 

Bass--looking at the photos on your jujube web page, it appears Li is much larger than the others. Is this typical? If its flavor is as good as the others, it would seem that the bigger fruit would give the best yield. I tasted a jujube once at a rare fruit growers meeting, and wasn't impressed, but I expect it was one of the dry types you mentioned. Maybe if I can find a Li I'll give it a try.


Subject: My Best Ripe figs are stollen by a band of little thives Replies: 24
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 1,683
 
Speaking of Havaharts, I just went out to take a shot of the 59 tally-marks on mine, and saw it was occupied--so I got a felt-tipped pen and made it an even 60. So far, pack rats like this one haven't touched the figs, but they've sure chewed up my citrus! (They gnaw big patches of bark, and nip off all the new little branches.) However, once I got serious about keeping the trap set, the trees are growing properly again--and I mostly catch young rats like this one, who are just arriving from other places.

There was also a family of rock squirrels that moved in a few years ago, and stripped off all of my half-grown apples. The same kind of trap worked great for them, Herman--maybe few strategically-placed Havaharts would rescue your figs as well!

Attached Images
jpeg not-so-lucky_#60.jpg (71.96 KB, 44 views)


Subject: Jon's favorite Figs! Replies: 15
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 1,912
 

...and the one I bought from a local nursery was labeled as "improved" brown Turkey, so I'm not sure what it is. I assume it's eastern, because the figs are big--but not nearly as big as the photo of the Monrovia BT above. Confusing indeed.


Subject: A visitor on a fig leaf Replies: 8
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 1,087
 

Beautiful shot!


Subject: Fig "milk" affecting skin/mouth Replies: 14
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 9,294
 
I have an elderly friend who loves figs from his black mission tree, but complains that if he eats too many they "take the roof off" his mouth. I know he eats them skin and all, but don't know whether he lets them get fully ripe.

I grew up peeling my figs, but have found that if I peel a lot of them on several successive days, it thins out the skin on my fingertips till they're raw and painful. I had assumed it was due to abrasion from handling the slightly rough skin, but this makes me think it's probably due to the enzyme.

Subject: started the orchard what do yall think Replies: 14
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 1,002
 

Wish I could trade my rocky desert "soil" in for some of yours! It looks like you have a great space. How far apart did you space the trees?


Subject: bird netting enclosure Replies: 45
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 4,745
 
UPDATE 12 Sep 2010
It's now cleared and fenced. This view is about midway along the south side, looking east. Posts are about 7'-6" on center. The little shed at the far end is an old playhouse that I relocated for keeping pots and stuff. The thing to the right of it is a compost pile.

Next I'll rig the post-and-wire framework that will support the bird netting. I will probably wait until spring to install the netting, though, since there's nothing that needs to be protected before then. I looked at Home Depot's EMT conduit, and although I had planned to use 3/4" diameter tubing, I think 1/2" will be strong enough--for about half the price. It's less than $2 per 10' length, so I should be able to get all the posts for less than $60, plus tax.

Attached Images
jpeg cleared_and_fenced_--_east_half.jpg (200.89 KB, 136 views)


Subject: Violette de Bordeaux A+++++++++ Replies: 32
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 6,285
 

With all of these rave reviews, I'm really looking forward to seeing my 2010 VdB cutting grow large enough to produce fruit. Does this variety tend to be pretty productive? How does the fruit quality compare to Black Madeira?


Subject: ucdavis fig collection Replies: 22
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 1,675
 

Gloria & Bass, it may be the dried fruit beetle, which is the one that spoils my Brown Turkey figs. Despite the name, they love to get inside the fresh figs. You might do a google image search to see more detailed photos for a positive ID.

Attached Images
jpeg dried_fruit_beetle.jpg (65.25 KB, 22 views)


Subject: What's the problem? Replies: 17
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 1,298
 

Thanks--I enjoyed your diagnosis of "nutrient indigestion" as well!


Subject: bird netting enclosure Replies: 45
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 4,745
 

Thanks, Gene and Noss. Fishing line sounds very promising--I'll see what I can find out about how it holds up to constant sunlight. If it's UV stable, it would be ideal.


Subject: Montlake Fig needs identification Replies: 4
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 839
 

I only have my black mission to go by, but it never gets any kind of hollow space in the center. Do other BM's ever get as much of an open "chamber" as the one in the photo?


Subject: bird netting enclosure Replies: 45
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 4,745
 
Dennis & Jason--
I'm glad my future fig-fortress may end up being useful to other bird-plagued fignuts. I'll definitely post updates as it comes together. The framework for supporting the netting should be a very economical way to enclose a large area--I just hope it turns out to be as easy in reality as it looks in my imagination!

One thing I still haven't worked out--does anybody know of a cheap, UV-stable string or light twine that would work for splicing adjacent sections of mesh together? The plastic twines I've tried end up disintegrating after a year or two of desert sunshine.

Subject: What's the problem? Replies: 17
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 1,298
 
Based on what I have learned from others with much more knowledge and experience, yes, if you get cuttings from UCD, they will be infected with FMV. It also sounds like cuttings/plants from many other sources are likely to have it as well, and if your plants are "FMV-free" today, they probably won't be for long. The in-ground Brown Turkey I bought many years ago from a local nursery also has FMV, but I never even knew the problem existed until reading about it on F4F. Sure enough, when I examined the BT's leaves closely. I could see the telltale "patchiness" of the green pigment--but it has never caused any problem.

As near as I can tell from what I've been told, and what I've seen in my UCD cuttings, FMV seems to manifest itself periodically in mis-shapen leaves and/or uneven clorophyl distribution, and then the plant reverts back to totally normal-looking growth. It sounds like various things can trigger the symptoms, and it affects different varieties in different ways. Some of my cuttings (Tena, Excel) never showed any signs of FMV, but most of the others have a few weird-looking leaves. The only reason I posted my original question about the Celeste was because it looked so different from the others that I thought it must have had a different problem, and I was actually quite relieved to learn it was probably just FMV. So, my personal opinion is that it's something I accept as part of growing figs, and I'm not going to worry about it.



Subject: ucdavis fig collection Replies: 22
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 1,675
 

A great resource--thanks! If you have any info on their fig with accession # DIFC0164-1, I would appreciate knowing more about it.


Subject: Close Call Replies: 1
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 700
 

Glad your trees didn't get hurt! I used to not worry much about lightning, till about 12 years ago when my kids were out in the front yard, playing in the rain, and it struck a palm tree at the end of the driveway. Major attitude adjustment for all of us. Then, a couple of years ago, lightning struck a saguaro about 30 feet north of the house and blew it (the saguaro) into pieces. Yikes!


Subject: bird netting enclosure Replies: 45
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 4,745
 

I've been wanting to do this for quite a while, and am finally getting started on a bird netting enclosure large enough to protect figs as well as several other non-citrus fruits (the birds don't bother the citrus). I had put it on hold when I couldn't find an affordable source of netting with really small openings, but have decided to go ahead with a commercial mesh that's 5/8" x 3/4". We have one tiny bird species (verdin) that can squeeze through it, but it should stop all the others. Fig beetles can fit through as well, but I'll have to live with them.

Cost is a big concern right now, so everything has to be done for very little $$$. A low perimeter fence of salvaged chicken wire will keep the rabbits and javelinas out (the posts are salvaged 1/2" x 1/2" square steel rods, but rebar would work just as well). The "footprint" is 120 feet by 28 feet (with a corner cut off due to a power line easement), and the height will be 12 feet at the center ridge and 9 feet at the edges. The "tent" part will require about thirty 10' lengths of 3/4" EMT conduit, about 1000' of tie wire, and a 400' x 14' roll of bird netting ($123 plus shipping from http://www.amigoni.com/bird%20netting.htm).

Since I'm enclosing existing trees (persimmon, apple, 2 peach, 2 apricot, & 2 plum) I'm stuck with a layout that isn't the most efficient, but there should still be enough room to plant several of my UCD cuttings and other potted figs in the ground this spring. I'll post progress shots as I work on it.

Attached Images
jpeg future_orchard_cage_100829_rdc.jpg (114.80 KB, 241 views)


Subject: What's the problem? Replies: 17
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 1,298
 

Fortunately, the latest growth appears to be normal, so hopefully the periods of distortion will be brief and it will grow normally the rest of the time. Thanks again for the info.

Attached Images
jpeg Celeste_FMV.jpg (128.66 KB, 45 views)


Subject: Boric acid for ants Replies: 17
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 1,180
 

It sounds like in a pinch you can use vaseline--you might give that a try while you're waiting for your tanglefoot.


Subject: Please tell me how to get rid of 1 smart chipmunk Replies: 21
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 3,688
 
Hmmmm... Think I'll stick with my grandma's chili recipe. Coming up with two pounds of chipmunk chunks sounds like a lot more work than a trip to the Costco meat department.

Congrats on conquering that wascowy wodent! Some figs truly are to die for.

Subject: Source for Fig wasp found Replies: 17
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 1,789
 

I'll be very interested to hear how your experiment goes; to find out whether you're able to actually get the wasps established in your area.


Subject: Boric acid for ants Replies: 17
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 1,180
 

I had great results with tanglefoot several years ago, protecting a few young stone fruit trees from leafcutter ants. However, I killed one tree before learning not to apply it directly to the bark. I haven't ever tried it on fig trees, but I'd definitely do as Jon suggests and protect the bark just to be on the safe side.


Subject: Please tell me how to get rid of 1 smart chipmunk Replies: 21
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 3,688
 

I've had very good luck catching pack rats with a HavaHart trap, but if this guy's as smart as you say, then traps may not be an effective option. Depending on your personal attitude about such things, my next suggestion would be to stake out your trees with a pellet gun.


Subject: What's the problem? Replies: 17
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 1,298
 

Thanks very much for the feedback. I'll keep my fingers crossed and hope it's, at worst then, a seasonal problem, and that the tree will ultimately end up being a good producer.


Subject: What's the problem? Replies: 17
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 1,298
 

Jason--your photo looks like a few of my other ones. I've assumed they will just outgrow it over time. Has that been your experience?


Subject: Lobe low Replies: 1
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 592
 
I've noticed that as my figs are growing vigorously, on some of them the shape of the newest leaves progressively shifts from the normal, lobed shape to a simpler, triangular shape. On this Tena you can clearly see the transformation over the past few weeks from long, narrow lobes low on the plant to the new shape at the top. The leaves look healthy, so I'm not concerned, but I am curious about it. Can anybody tell me what's happening? Is this normal?

Attached Images
jpeg leaf_variation_--_tena.jpg (126.29 KB, 24 views)


Subject: What's the problem? Replies: 17
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 1,298
 

Most of this year's UCD cuttings are finally growing very nicely and responding well to being moved into larger pots, getting more sunshine, and having increased humidity due to our summer rainy season. The big exception is this Celeste, which looked like it was starting the same sort of new growth flush as the others, but all of the leaves are crinkled up and tiny. Can anybody tell me what's causing this? Earlier leaves were large and normally-shaped, with the only problem being splotchy pigmentation from FMV.

Attached Images
jpeg deformed_leaves_--_celeste.jpg (117.99 KB, 110 views)


Subject: Tips on repotting from cups Replies: 17
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 2,308
 

Jason--lots of great info here. Thanks for taking the time to share it with us!


Subject: Off Replies: 13
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 1,065
 

Was the dog a doberman "pincher"?


Subject: Anyone want to trade ???? Replies: 18
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 1,791
 
Kyle, I'm no expert, so maybe with some peaches there's some exception to the usual rules of sexual reproduction. For example, I've heard that some multi-embryonic mango seeds can produce at least one seedling that is genetically identical to the parent tree. I'm just advising a little caution and investigation before investing the time and effort in raising seedlings up to fruit-producing size. If you google the topic you'll find many opinions that are far more informed than mine, but I expect they'll run in the same direction, as in the following quote:

http://www.plantanswers.com/garden_column/jan05/2.htm
"Before some of you go peach-seed-planting crazy, I must warn you that planting seed is not the best way to propagate peaches. If you plant a seed of a good peach fruit that you have eaten, the resulting tree will not produce the same type of fruit that you desire. The fruit could be much smaller and poorer in quality. Remember that a seed results from the pollination of one peach flower by the pollen of another peach flower, possibly from another tree, so the resulting off-spring will differ from either parent. The surest method of getting what you want is to plant a budded tree. Varieties that are known to produce superior peaches are budded onto roots of already growing trees."

Subject: Anyone want to trade ???? Replies: 18
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 1,791
 

The only way to be guaranteed the same fruit is through vegetative reproduction (grafting, or possibly air layering, if that works with peaches). The seedlings will not be genetically identical to the mother tree, so they may, or may not, have good fruit.


Subject: Air-Layering Replies: 70
Posted By: TucsonKen Views: 7,717
 

No matter how well something works, it seems there's always some way to improve it! It does sound like an easier approach.


 

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